Peter Jackson to direct "The Hobbit"

[gbeenie]

How does it feel like to be an asshole?

See? Validation. Everything is right with the world.

I think you're onto something, Chaos. I've been using Ted Kennedy for this purpose for years, but maybe that's too abstract a concept to be useful (a recent survey of high schoolers shows that many of them consider him a myth). I might do better with a more immediate, down-to-earth focus. The plus is that, even when Isaac has some germ of correctness to his point, he states it such an abrasive and self-satisfied fashion that it makes me want to play devil's advocate (something everyone should do from time to time).

[Pak-Man]

You know what I love about Isaac's posts? It's not that they tend to be poorly defended (That part is mildly amusing) and it's not that they tend to further his anti-PJ Propaganda (Also amusing.) It's the way he sucks the Roundtable, normally a smart and intelligent group of adults, into acting half their age or less. It's a strange thing to see so many well-spoken adults suddenly devolve into kindergarteners. I'm not saying he's right (He HAS been, but you know what they say about stopped clocks) but if I could send a group of intelligent adults into whining and name-calling, I'd probably delight in being wrong too. Oh it always starts out rationally, and it always ends rationally,but the 3 or 4 pages that happen between the beginning and end are like some alternate universe.

I like you, Issac. I rarely, if ever, agree with you, but you don't deserve half the scorn that gets heaped on you most of the time, yet you keep on trucking and standing by your beliefs, even in the face of common sense. You even go so far as to disarm everyone of all  their common sense. It's a beautiful thing to behold. Stick around, man. You keep it interesting. :^)

[Petey Wheatstraw]

These comments, "you know what they say about stopped clocks", "even in the face of common sense"...are ridiculous. I'm always using common sense. Often, I'm the only person with any sense. I don't know how my views are "extreme", or that I am supposedly the reason that so many people here act like children. That's not it at all. I'm often the only person with maturity, because certain people who can't handle the fact that I disagree with them on certain issues don't have it all together, and go crazy. There's nothing I'd rather have than a discussion that doesn't turn into shit, but you know how the Internet goes, sometimes people turn into howler-monkeys because they can't act that way around actual people (well, sober at least).

The comments that I've posed about Jackson are not "propaganda". Propaganda is fiction passed off as truth to further political means. This word has no bearing in a discussion involving film. My comments aren't more negative than they have to be. I'm not being negative for the sake of being negative. I am simply speaking the truth. There is nothing I have said about Peter Jackson that doesn't reflect reality. Is it entirely impossible to look at Jackson as something less than perfect?

You've got to understand, I largely look at film as a medium in terms of entertainment value in addition to substance. The fact that Jackson took liberties with the story isn't the only reason I didn't like these films. You can't jump on me for that. One of the major reasons I find the films to be overrated is because they don't really stand out, to me, as being a product for which a director has made it his own. Great directors are able to use original visual ideas and storytelling techniques to make audiences think "This is a [Insert Director's Name] film." I didn't see that in Jackson's attempt. I saw a lot of ideas from other sources, but it didn't leave much of an impression on me.

[doggans]

Now, everybody has a right to their opinion. I can buy someone thinking PJ's trilogy wasn't in the spirit of the books. I don't agree with that (well, except where Faramir is concerned, of course), but I can understand and respect that opinion.

What I can't possibly understand is someone thinking Bakshi's version is more in the spirit of the books than Jackson's version.

[Petey Wheatstraw]

Pretty much every serious Tolkien enthusiast I've talked to believes that that website - the Flying Moose - is horseshit. The writer of that piece knows nothing about Tolkien, he exaggerates minor flaws of the film, and claims flaws that aren't even there, sometimes with altered, low quality screencaps. I personally believe the person behind that site is a little snot-nosed punk who wanted to be a writer on Mystery Science Theater 3000, but had absolutely no talent. I think that if you sat him in front of a microphone for a RiffTrax, he would just sit there drooling. The only sound we'd hear would be a low, guttural "uuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh".

[esoobaC .T bocaJ]

Hi , stupid here again,

What does all this have to do with (Guillermo del Toro to direct "The Hobbit")?

[Petey Wheatstraw]

I'm not being completely off-topic. It's absolutely acceptable to discuss adaptations of J.R.R. Tolkien's writing in a thread about The Hobbit.

[esoobaC .T bocaJ]

I was talking about Hitler, and the ted Kennedy and the arguing back and forth, and the Watchasockies and the budget for the film, and the awards, and David Lynch.  by the way, Hitler has an account here.

[doggans]

Pretty much every serious Tolkien enthusiast I've talked to believes that that website - the Flying Moose - is horseshit.

To be fair, the website is called "The Tolkien Sarcasm Page", so I don't think serious objective criticism was his goal.

[Petey Wheatstraw]

When was David Lynch brought up? I don't remember that part of the conversation.

[esoobaC .T bocaJ]

I am sure Issac knows alot more about film making then The Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences.

The Academy Awards are really overrated. I mean, look at all the important directors who never won an Oscar:

    * Robert Altman (5)
    * Michelangelo Antonioni (1)
    * Ingmar Bergman (3)
    * John Cassavetes (1)
    * Charles Chaplin (1)
    * Cecil B. De Mille (1)
    * Federico Fellini (4)
    * Howard Hawks (1)
    * Alfred Hitchcock (5)
    * Stanley Kubrick (4)
    * Akira Kurosawa (1)
    * Fritz Lang (0)
    * David Lynch (3)
    * Alan J. Pakula (1)
    * Sam Peckinpah (0)
    * Jean Renoir (1)
    * Francois Truffaut (1)
    * Orson Welles (1)

Another thing, I seem to recall that Waking Life was initially supposed to be nominated for a "Best Animated Film" Oscar, but they nominated the derivative, poorly-written, badly-designed film Jimmy Neutron: Boy Genius instead, because some bright guy got the idea that if an R-rated animated film would win an Oscar, all Hell would break loose, that there would be too much controversy. I don't trust an awards ceremony that eliminates films based on how controversial they perceive the reactions to that film winning would be.

[sarcasm_made_Easy]

These comments, "you know what they say about stopped clocks", "even in the face of common sense"...are ridiculous. I'm always using common sense. Often, I'm the only person with any sense. I don't know how my views are "extreme", or that I am supposedly the reason that so many people here act like children. That's not it at all. I'm often the only person with maturity, because certain people who can't handle the fact that I disagree with them on certain issues don't have it all together, and go crazy. There's nothing I'd rather have than a discussion that doesn't turn into shit, but you know how the Internet goes, sometimes people turn into howler-monkeys because they can't act that way around actual people (well, sober at least).

The comments that I've posed about Jackson are not "propaganda". Propaganda is fiction passed off as truth to further political means. This word has no bearing in a discussion involving film. My comments aren't more negative than they have to be. I'm not being negative for the sake of being negative. I am simply speaking the truth. There is nothing I have said about Peter Jackson that doesn't reflect reality. Is it entirely impossible to look at Jackson as something less than perfect?

You've got to understand, I largely look at film as a medium in terms of entertainment value in addition to substance. The fact that Jackson took liberties with the story isn't the only reason I didn't like these films. You can't jump on me for that. One of the major reasons I find the films to be overrated is because they don't really stand out, to me, as being a product for which a director has made it his own. Great directors are able to use original visual ideas and storytelling techniques to make audiences think "This is a [Insert Director's Name] film." I didn't see that in Jackson's attempt. I saw a lot of ideas from other sources, but it didn't leave much of an impression on me.

The fact that you site that EVERYBODY else is wrong and you are right ALL BY YOURSELF is as near to the definition of  insanity as i can possibly name man.  You arent perfect nor are you always right.  if you ever find yourself in the position where you and you alone are holding a position then you SERIOUSLY need to reexamine that position because its more than likely flawed.  

Also your definition of propaganda is wrong.  its not fiction passed off to sway people.  Its something produced to sway people.  thats it.  If i show you a movie that show taliban members forcing young women to get female circumcistions (also known as mutliation) and that movie has the position that the taliban are evil and that this practice must be stopped.  It wouldnt be fiction it would be true, AND it would be propaganda.  Somehow somewhere the word propaganda has developed some sort of stigma.  Which is attaching irrational feelings to a word in the hopes that you can somehow change the meaning or usage of a word.  there is nothing wrong with propaganda.  There may be something wrong with opinions expressed by such a medium.  

Further im still waiting for a response to my original post.

Oh and pak you cant condemn us for getting sucked in.  If we didnt then how would you be amused by it?

[Petey Wheatstraw]

I never said that I was right and everyone else is wrong.

your definition of propaganda is wrong.  its not fiction passed off to sway people.  Its something produced to sway people.

Whatever. The point is that the idea of "propaganda" should not be brought up in a discussion of films.

[ChrisHanel]

Wow. I've been missing out on a good thread.

*popcorn*

[Petey Wheatstraw]

Another thing, posters here only point out when I appear abrasive about my opinions when they disagree with me. That doesn't seem particularly fair.