Any way to strip HDCP off of legally-purchased digital files?

[LucasM]

I have an audio and video system in my home theater room that I am very happy with.  Given that, (and the relative tolerance of my neck and back to seating at my computer and in that home theater room) under no circumstances would I ever watch a film on my computer, and I have had less than satisfactory streaming experience with every service I've ever tried for it (the film wasn't available streaming at 1080p anyway).

I already own a film on DVD.  I know it is highly unlikely to ever be released on blu-ray (not successful enough), but I want it with better sound and more detailed picture.  I want to buy this film in 1080p, download it to my hard drive & burn it to a DVD-R or store it on a flash drive, and play it on my Panasonic 65" plasma HDTV, with the sound through my Infinity towers.  But iTunes clearly says that films purchased there use HDCP and their Customer 'Service' says there's nothing I can do.  I can only assume that Amazon is the same.

[I actually thought about finding a 1080p copy illegally on the internet, PAYING for the film via iTunes and just downloading the illegal copy: no harm, no foul.  But from what I can tell, there is no copy of it in that resolution that I can find in either torrents or newsgroups.]

Is it possible to strip the HDCP from a film purchased from iTunes or Amazon so I can use it conveniently?  [I've never purchased a digital film and, honestly, never thought there'd be something I felt strongly enough about to buy as a file instead of buying a 'hard copy'.  Is it even possible to get a film from iTunes 'solid' enough on a hard drive so it could be manipulated by a program that might strip the HDCP from it?]  I have NO intention of sharing it, either with friends or via the internet.  But if I pay for it, I expect to be able to actually USE it.  And limited to 'on the computer' is not remotely useful to me.

Any help would be appreciated.

[I may request a moderator delete this thread once I have an answer...  if they don't delete it before then.]

[Variety of Cells]

Now this isn't the answer you are asking for, but have you considered getting a good up converting dvd player?  I never made the switch to a blue-ray player because I never found it necessary, and I'm something of a film snob.

This is what I have, the Toshiba XDE  http://www.amazon.com/Toshiba-XDE-600-Up-Converting-Multi-Format-Player/dp/B003ZFRA00  It does a great job of translating DVD resolution to a higher resolution display.  I highly recommend it.  My TV is not quite as big as yours, but the XDE still might be useful for you in instances where you can't find a blu ray.

As for striping anti piracy protection, I'm sure it can be done.  But it's the kind of thing where googling it gives you viruses and tons of sites say they can do it if you give them money, but who knows if they actually can.  If you decide to go that route without a guide, be careful.

[LucasM]

Thanks, VoC.  My Panasonic blu-ray player upconverts quite well.  To the point, actually, where the picture of the upconverted DVD looked better than a DVR'd 'off-air' 720p version of the film and with the DVD I saw a lot of details I'd missed while watching it the first 1/2-dozen times (though the colors were slightly muted with the DVD, the detail [and lack of on-screen station logo and ads] easily made up for it).

Oh well.  I figured it would be iffy on doing what I wanted.  I wish that film companies would take into account how people might actually use such files, and make them able to be watched wherever.  Those who actually want to pay for items get penalized for it, when it doesn't really stop pirates ('casual' ones, yes, but not those determined to pirate).

[MartyS (Gromit)]

Stripping iTunes DRM is possible, if you still have iTunes 10.7 or older there is a program called Requiem that works great.  But VoC is correct, just looking for DRM removal software can lead you to sites loaded with spyware.

The up-scaling option starts to break down when you move to a bigger screen, only so much can be done through interpolation.

What problems do you have with streaming?  Internet not reliable enough?  Or are the apps on the TV too clunky?  I pretty much only use my Roku box for streaming now, way better interface for Netflix, Amazon, and Vudu than on my TV or Blu-Ray player.  I just used the VuduToGo option to get the HD streaming versions of a bunch of DVDs for about $2 each since I did 10 of them, unfortunately the selection is limited, I wanted to do a bunch more but Vudu doesn't have them.

[LucasM]

Stripping iTunes DRM is possible, if you still have iTunes 10.7 or older there is a program called Requiem that works great.  But VoC is correct, just looking for DRM removal software can lead you to sites loaded with spyware.

The up-scaling option starts to break down when you move to a bigger screen, only so much can be done through interpolation.

What problems do you have with streaming?  Internet not reliable enough?  Or are the apps on the TV too clunky?  I pretty much only use my Roku box for streaming now, way better interface for Netflix, Amazon, and Vudu than on my TV or Blu-Ray player.  I just used the VuduToGo option to get the HD streaming versions of a bunch of DVDs for about $2 each since I did 10 of them, unfortunately the selection is limited, I wanted to do a bunch more but Vudu doesn't have them.

Yeah, programs that might do illegal things in the wrong hands are often associated with hackers who don't do things from altruistic motives, but use 'advertising' to lure suckers in so they can invade their computers and steal information or just mess them up.

I do still have iTunes v10.7 because v11 eliminated the 'album flow' and so I couldn't set up the interface the way I prefer it.  I'll check out Requiem.  What I've read so far is that it leaves most personally-identifiably info on the files, which is fine by me, and would help me to prove I had no intention of sharing if the need ever arose to prove such a thing.

Yeah, interpolation helps, but, while I could see more detail in some parts of the film from the DVD that weren't in the 720p version (e.g. able to make out faces in crowds easier), it was clear that the whole thing, overall, was fuzzier (more pixilated) than the 720p.  Only thing I can figure is that maybe my 720p 'off-air' copy isn't as pure as I thought it was... possibly they used much higher compression when airing it on TV than the DVD had, so, while edges were sharper on the 720p, detail was lost from the compression.

For streaming: Yeah, my internet speed sometimes varies tremendously.  During late evening I've noticed it range from 2.6Mbps to 12.4Mbps in a matter of minutes.  Obviously one can't watch a film like that... particularly a HD film.

But possibly the key thing for me is I'll always want a 'hard copy' of whatever I buy.  If it is on someone else's hard drive (Amazon, iTunes, whatever) it can always be removed at any time (or if my cable internet goes down - like it did a month or so ago - if the file is on my hard drive or burned to a DVD-R, I can still watch it).  If it is on my hard drive, then I govern if and when files are moved or deleted or how I choose to use them.

[[Crap... from the length/detail on this page alone, much less other things I've written here in the last 24 hours, it's clear I'm seizing pretty bad. ]]




EDIT:  Shit... so far past my limits I got caught up in the technical stuff so much that I didn't start this the way it should have been started.  With "Thank you very much, MartyS!"  Sorry about that.

[MartyS (Gromit)]

  Yeah, for some reason the video industry has yet to catch up to the music industry in realizing that letting people buy stuff AND have a copy they can actually use anywhere makes them more money than driving their customers crazy with restrictions...

  Internet speeds being that variable would mess up even 720p streaming, you really need a minimum consistent 6Mbps to do HD streaming.   Having good internet allowed me to dump iTunes and move to Amazon streaming, would not have happened if I was still on DSL at 3Mbps.  And considering I have a crapload of stuff on disc I haven't gotten around to watching yet, if I lost the ability to stream for a month I would be fine.

  I used to worry about the fact that the stuff I have bought that is streaming only could disappear at the whim of the studios or Amazon or Vudu but I just sort of got over it.  Can't really point to any reason why, it just sort of happened.  Maybe shows and movies going on and off of Netflix streaming all the time helped me realize I wouldn't really miss that stuff if it went away, even though I paid for it.

[LucasM]

I think somewhere buried in Amazon's fine print it says, "if you buy a digital film from us, make sure to save a copy to your hard drive because we may not always have it available."  That bumped up my attention to, and concern for, the possibility of them disappearing on pure-streaming.

And yeah, my internet speed usually normalizes at about midnight-1am (which is usually fine by me), but there have still been times where a sudden drop would cause the screen to go black and freeze the TV's internet-access software altogether.  Particularly for films I like enough to want to watch repeatedly (a tiny number of those I've seen), I'd rather be confident going into the film that I'd be able to finish it that night.


Well, I bought the film in HD, stripped the DRM with Requiem, then had another program I have [Wondershare Video Converter Ultimate] translate it from m4v (which my blu-ray player can't play directly) to mp4 (which it can).

I just took the briefest of views at the film in 1080p on the computer and - literally - gasped at how much better it looked than either the DVD or the 720p 'off-air' versions (it confirmed my thought that the 720p ver was probably highly compressed, losing detail, with a little edge-enhancement so it looked more detailed... because actually seeing all the detail blew it away far more than any 720p-1080p comparison I've ever seen).

Even though I JUST watched the film from the DVD again last night, I plan to watch it again tonight in 1080p (taking it downstairs on a convenient flash drive), because it basically looks like a new film entirely.

Thanks again to all who helped!


Further/related question:
One thing I notice with my Wondershare Video Converter Ultimate is that there is no option for 'lossless' conversion from one format to another.  I always go with 'High Quality' and set the specifics to the highest bitrate available for video and audio, but was wondering if anyone had a simple program for lossless conversions [even if just for m4v to mp4]?  Thanks again.

[MrTorso]

Honestly I have heard tale of just changing the extension to MP4 and it works. In fact I just did it right now and VLC had no issues playing it. Worth a shot.

[MrTorso]

I did some google-fu and you may run into problems doing that extension trick if the audio is AC3.   Personally when I use requiem I convert everything to the MKV container for use on my WDTV.

[MartyS (Gromit)]

Glad you got it to work, it is kind of odd there are so much downloadable or streaming HD that is not out on Blu-Ray, some of it I've noticed is not much better than up-scaled DVD but some really looks like new HD transfers.  New transfers are not cheap, so you would think if they spent that money they would put the stuff out on physical media.

I think somewhere buried in Amazon's fine print it says, "if you buy a digital film from us, make sure to save a copy to your hard drive because we may not always have it available."  That bumped up my attention to, and concern for, the possibility of them disappearing on pure-streaming.

2 years ago I gave up on Amazon downloads because the files were so restricted, don't know if they have improved that situation but the files would only play on the device they were downloaded to, and even worse only that install of the unbox software.  Reinstall the software and the files wouldn't play, making you waste another download, and you only get a couple.

Further/related question:
One thing I notice with my Wondershare Video Converter Ultimate is that there is no option for 'lossless' conversion from one format to another.  I always go with 'High Quality' and set the specifics to the highest bitrate available for video and audio, but was wondering if anyone had a simple program for lossless conversions [even if just for m4v to mp4]?  Thanks again.

m4v and mp4 are supposed to be the same, I've had good luck simply renaming them.

All programs will reprocess if you don't set the output settings to exactly the same as the input file, and since they don't often have easy ways of telling you all the details of the input file I usually play it in VLC and there are menu options in VLC that will tell you everything about the file it is playing (resolution, bitrates, codec type, etc.).

[LucasM]

With the renaming m4v to mp4, my blu-ray player appears to have an upper limit on file sizes it will play directly, about 4GB.  This m4v film is nearly 5GB.

If I ever run into the m4v problem with smaller files, I'll give that a try.


Thanks for the heads-up on VLC's file details.  Will give that a look.  If it turns out file sizes will be bigger than usable (>4GB) with a translation, at least I'll have an idea what will get altered and can be selective about it, rather than leaving it to the program (if I don't like it's initial output).

[MartyS (Gromit)]

 Wow, that's a new issue, never heard of a player having issues with file size.

Does your TV play mp4s?  I'm assuming it has a USB port since it's so new.

[LucasM]

I'll try again with the file size with a few different files.  It may be it just had a file size problem with a particular file's encoding at that size(?).

The TV has USB inputs, but then the output sound is limited.  The best available at present from it is through optical cable; blu-ray player has a dedicated HDMI output for audio.  But now that you bring it up, if the TV tolerates the file size, presuming it has one, I could see myself getting an HDMI out for the TV audio and leaving the blu-ray player off entirely for digital video files.

[MartyS (Gromit)]

One other thing I thought of, was the video file from iTunes that large?  Maybe it was made larger by the conversion program?

As far as the sound goes, pretty unlikely any mp4 files will have audio that would max out the optical cable.  Pretty much the only time you need HDMI for audio is for uncompressed Blu-Ray audio, that exceeds the bandwidth for optical.

But, check to see if the TV has audio return channel (ARC) on one of it's HDMI ports, and if your receiver will accept it on it's output to the TV. 

[LucasM]

Yes, the iTunes file was 4.57GB (not the 4.9 I may have said earlier).  1080p nearly-two-hour film.  It would actually have been nice if it was about 4.38... just large enough to about max out a DVD-R.  [The conversion program knocked it down quite a bit actually, to about 3GB.]

Good to know on the optical/mp4 audio.  Thanks.

I'll have to look at the TV specs for ARC on the HDMI.  The receiver has - I think - two open HDMI inputs that can be assigned to whatever is needed if need be.