House of 1000 Corpses and The Devil's Rejects <spoilers>

[chinton]

I despised House Of A Thousand Corpses. It wasn't funny or exciting or enlightening. It was one of the worst film experiences I've ever had. I hated it.

[MrTorso]

Torso, Isaac, others, can you  tell me specifically what you thought was awesome?

Not ripping on either of you (yet*) but I really want to know how you can love those films.

Thanks.

*  :-)

I prefer Devil's Rejects over House of 1000 Corpses. As for why I love it? Probably a number of things. I like the obvious homages to previous films. I like the actors were used or had cameos. Like Ginger Lynn (80's Porn star), Ken Foree (Dawn of the Dead), Michael Berryman (Hills have eyes), P.J. Soles (Rock-n-Roll High School, Halloween,Carrie), Bill Moseley (Texas Chainsaw 2), Leslie Easterbrook (Police Academy), Deborah Van Valkenburgh (The Warriors), Mary Woronov (Rock-N-roll High School, Eating Raoul). Sid Haig is always entertaining to me.

I grew up watching horror flicks. I read horror books. I had subscriptions to Fango for many years. I saw Halloween and Texas Chainsaw Massacre in the theater when they opened. I know that Rob Zombie wishes he could have been one of those pioneers like Wes Craven, Sean Cunningham, Meir Zarchi, Tobe Hooper etc..but he is trying to make things his own. I love the movies because you start rooting for the bad guys. When you watch most Hollywood crap it is the same thing. Good guy wins. Everybody is happy at the end. I say fuck that! I want to see complete opposites of what 99% of movie-going audiences want to see. How many movies have been ruined by stupid test screeners? Look at Army of Darkness. The original ending was so much better than the happy S-Mart ending. Why did it get changed? It was too depressing. So what! That ending fit so much better with the other flicks than the "happy" ending. Who cares if someone is depressed at the end? It is just a movie. 

Does any of that really explain why I like them? Probably not. But who really cares? You never are going to change anyone's mind about things like this anyway. You either like it or you don't. No matter what I say or reasons I have for enjoying a particular film are ever going to convince someone else to like it.

[ScottotD]

  But man...the celebration of murder and torture was horrible.

Ithink what you're forgetting is that it's only a movie. 

Given the choice, 90% of the time I'd rather see a 'celebration of murder' than a 'celebration of the human spirit' or 'a celebration of family'.  Different strokes for different folks.

[MarkAndrew]

  But man...the celebration of murder and torture was horrible.

Ithink what you're forgetting is that it's only a movie. 

Given the choice, 90% of the time I'd rather see a 'celebration of murder' than a 'celebration of the human spirit' or 'a celebration of family'.  Different strokes for different folks.

Just a movie?  Movies are our stories, they create our legends, create our culture, inspire our fantasies.

And this isn't light entertainment, not Loony Tunes where nobody gets hurt.  It's not depicted in a unrealistic, cartoony fashion...especially The Devil's Rejects.
It shows bad people doing bad things to innocent, if a little annoying, people.

I'm not going to rip on you for saying you prefer a 'celebration of murder' to a 'celebration of the human spirit' or 'a celebration of family'*.  I am asking WHAT specifically do you (and the other fans of the films) find enjoyable about seeing manics murder kids without consequence.


*Though it's tempting

[ScottotD]

oh noes! don't rip on me please!!!11111

I, on the whole find horror movies more exciting, funny and entertaining than other genres.  It's a matter of personal taste, you're free to watch Pay it Forward or Forrest Gump and feel all fuzzy inside all you want, I prefer horror.

[sarcasm_made_Easy]

I'm not going to rip on you for saying you prefer a 'celebration of murder' to a 'celebration of the human spirit' or 'a celebration of family'*.  I am asking WHAT specifically do you (and the other fans of the films) find enjoyable about seeing manics murder kids without consequence.

its only interesting until youve really seen it.  then you never want to be reminded of it ever again.

[MarkAndrew]

Torso, Isaac, others, can you  tell me specifically what you thought was awesome?

Not ripping on either of you (yet*) but I really want to know how you can love those films.

Thanks.

*  :-)

I prefer Devil's Rejects over House of 1000 Corpses. As for why I love it? Probably a number of things. I like the obvious homages to previous films. I like the actors were used or had cameos. Like Ginger Lynn (80's Porn star), Ken Foree (Dawn of the Dead), Michael Berryman (Hills have eyes), P.J. Soles (Rock-n-Roll High School, Halloween,Carrie), Bill Moseley (Texas Chainsaw 2), Leslie Easterbrook (Police Academy), Deborah Van Valkenburgh (The Warriors), Mary Woronov (Rock-N-roll High School, Eating Raoul). Sid Haig is always entertaining to me.

I grew up watching horror flicks. I read horror books. I had subscriptions to Fango for many years. I saw Halloween and Texas Chainsaw Massacre in the theater when they opened. I know that Rob Zombie wishes he could have been one of those pioneers like Wes Craven, Sean Cunningham, Meir Zarchi, Tobe Hooper etc..but he is trying to make things his own. I love the movies because you start rooting for the bad guys. When you watch most Hollywood crap it is the same thing. Good guy wins. Everybody is happy at the end. I say fuck that! I want to see complete opposites of what 99% of movie-going audiences want to see. How many movies have been ruined by stupid test screeners? Look at Army of Darkness. The original ending was so much better than the happy S-Mart ending. Why did it get changed? It was too depressing. So what! That ending fit so much better with the other flicks than the "happy" ending. Who cares if someone is depressed at the end? It is just a movie. 

Does any of that really explain why I like them? Probably not. But who really cares? You never are going to change anyone's mind about things like this anyway. You either like it or you don't. No matter what I say or reasons I have for enjoying a particular film are ever going to convince someone else to like it.

thanks Torso, I appreciate your response. 
I'm not trying to change people's minds...that would be a bonus, but not my goal.
  It does explain where you at least are coming from. And again, I do think Rob Zombie has a lot of skill, the detail and stylization of these two films is at least as good at QT's.

    I find myself rooting for the bad guys as well, or wishing at least the bad guy's motivations were explained and addressed.  And I used to enjoy horror, down endings especially. 
  I do think horror movies where the main character's triumph through no merit or no action of their own isn't...well, it isn't horror...and it isn't good.  I like the ending to Evil Dead 2 much better than Army of Darkness personally.
  I guess my tastes have changed to an extent as I've gotten older.  I think you can have a good movie where the villian is the protagonist, Richard the 3rd comes to mind.  I have to be able to identify with the protagonist to enjoy a movie...and I couldn't see myself identifying with any of the Firefly family.  I wanted to strap up and put them down before they killed anyone else.

[Raven]

I just wanted to toss in my two cents.  I actually really liked both of these movies.  Although I was a fan of Rob Zombie before he directed either movie so I may have been a bit bias.  I believe that he made the exact movie that he said he was going to make.  His tribute film to the 70's horror movies.   It was a nice change from all of the horror movies in the 10 years prior to it's release that relied mainly on false suspense, and not so scary villians. These sucked so badly because they were clamoring for the PG-13 rating to scare mainly high school girls.  It was nice to see a horror movie made for actual adults. 

I really enjoyed the style in which the movie was filmed and the slow motion crane shot involving the killing of the policeman is one of my favorite scenes in any movie.  And Sid Haig was one of the most entertaining characters in a long time as captain spaulding.  I can understand both sides of the reasons people have given for not liking the movie.  Fans who like popcorn horror and happy endings don't get it hear and huge movie buffs looking for many layers of cinematic excellence are disappointed.  It is what it is.  I haven't had the opportunity yet but I'm going to make an edited version of Devil's Rejects for my girlfriend to watch (she's not a big fan of gore).  I guess quite a few people have recommended it to her on storytelling merit.  I think watching one without the other is a great mistake for people who didn't enjoy the first movie.  If you liked the first you'll more than likely enjoy the second.  And if you didn't like House I think Devil's Rejects will greatly improve your opinion of both Zombie and House.  The gore factor is still very high so if that was your major hang up, you probably won't like either.

In regards to the other movies discussed, I enjoyed the saw movies for what they were and it's become a tradition that we catch a matinee before the haunted house we run each halloween.  The gore is way overdone and I think it's great that actors still have a place to go when they are on the down side of there careers besides the Left Behind franchise.  But to me the biggest insult to horror movies ever has to be Cabin Fever.  It's an hour and a half of watching people catch a really strong flu.  There are no entities after them, no human bad guy, just character after character getting sick.  And shame on Peter Jackson for allowing his name to get people to the theater to see this one. 

[MarkAndrew]

I just wanted to toss in my two cents.  I actually really liked both of these movies.  Although I was a fan of Rob Zombie before he directed either movie so I may have been a bit bias.  I believe that he made the exact movie that he said he was going to make.  His tribute film to the 70's horror movies.   It was a nice change from all of the horror movies in the 10 years prior to it's release that relied mainly on false suspense, and not so scary villians. These sucked so badly because they were clamoring for the PG-13 rating to scare mainly high school girls.  It was nice to see a horror movie made for actual adults. 

I really enjoyed the style in which the movie was filmed and the slow motion crane shot involving the killing of the policeman is one of my favorite scenes in any movie.  And Sid Haig was one of the most entertaining characters in a long time as captain spaulding.  I can understand both sides of the reasons people have given for not liking the movie.  Fans who like popcorn horror and happy endings don't get it hear and huge movie buffs looking for many layers of cinematic excellence are disappointed.  It is what it is.  I haven't had the opportunity yet but I'm going to make an edited version of Devil's Rejects for my girlfriend to watch (she's not a big fan of gore).  I guess quite a few people have recommended it to her on storytelling merit.  I think watching one without the other is a great mistake for people who didn't enjoy the first movie.  If you liked the first you'll more than likely enjoy the second.  And if you didn't like House I think Devil's Rejects will greatly improve your opinion of both Zombie and House.  The gore factor is still very high so if that was your major hang up, you probably won't like either.

In regards to the other movies discussed, I enjoyed the saw movies for what they were and it's become a tradition that we catch a matinee before the haunted house we run each halloween.  The gore is way overdone and I think it's great that actors still have a place to go when they are on the down side of there careers besides the Left Behind franchise.  But to me the biggest insult to horror movies ever has to be Cabin Fever.  It's an hour and a half of watching people catch a really strong flu.  There are no entities after them, no human bad guy, just character after character getting sick.  And shame on Peter Jackson for allowing his name to get people to the theater to see this one. 

Thanks for your input Raven.
  I thought Sid Haig was hilarious in 1000 corpses.  The DVD menu featuring him was funny, profane...and menacing.  I DID prefer it when he was ambiguous...you didn't know if he was ignorant of the Firefly clan, part of it or maybe even opposed to them.  The ending of 1000 corpses with him in the car, punched me in the gut.
  I have been thinking about why I hated these movies so much, but am a fan of other horror movies.  I think it comes down to rationale.  If the killer has a reason, even if it's a damaged sexual compulsion as the classic serial killer has, it makes it easier to understand him.  Not approve of, but you can sympathize with someone who was abused as the killer in Red Dragon was, or was wronged as the killer in Night of the Scarecrow or out of a sense of professionalism as in The Day of the Jackal.
  The Firefly family killed for their own amusement.  For kicks baby, for kicks.  That strikes me as so wrong on a visceral level that I react to it.  Which I think makes a good argument for Rob Zombie being a good artist.  I've listened to his commentary on the films and he himself is bemused by people cheering for people who are completely, irredeemably bad.

[Rude]

...

So a girlfriend of mine ended up with preview passes to the first showing of The Devil's Rejects. Since we shared the same taste in music and gore i was like, a shoo-in for her extra ticket. Even after House let me down, i was eager to see Zombie's new film.

Anyway, there we were squeezed into a totally packed theater. And this wasn't your usual freebie screening. Everyone was there to see this movie... the press and media, film critics, and tons of fans were squeezed into every empty space they could find. Finally, someone made a little anouncement and the film started to roll, no previews or anything...

Right towards the end, the movie reaches this critical moment, a crescendo of violence... when the film literally burnt in the projector. It looked so cool that everyone mistook it for part of the actual movie for a few seconds before the lights came up. I mean, it really looked staged... almost too perfect, ya' know?

With the timing, this being the very first showing, and a press preview and everything, i totally expected Zombie himself to walk out and say something like... "Thanks for coming out to The Devil's Rejects! But to see the amazing ending make sure to show up on opening day!"

Of course that didn't happen, and after about 15 minutes we got to see the end. ("Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?" - Johnny Rotten) But it was kind of cool and i felt like rambling to you fine people about my stupid little experience~ 

-Rude

[Raven]

If the killer has a reason, even if it's a damaged sexual compulsion as the classic serial killer has, it makes it easier to understand him.  Not approve of, but you can sympathize with someone who was abused as the killer in Red Dragon was, or was wronged as the killer in Night of the Scarecrow or out of a sense of professionalism as in The Day of the Jackal.
  The Firefly family killed for their own amusement.  For kicks baby, for kicks.  That strikes me as so wrong on a visceral level that I react to it.  Which I think makes a good argument for Rob Zombie being a good artist.  I've listened to his commentary on the films and he himself is bemused by people cheering for people who are completely, irredeemably bad.

I think it's a good thing if sometimes characters just are for the sake of being.  If there's justification for there actions, (within a horror movie anyway) it decreases from their scariness.  Traditional horror doesn't scare me for that reason.  I don't jump in the theater when I'm told to and a horror movie really has to freak me out to the core for it to even resonate with me.  I think that there is more depth to the characters in this case without a back story than if he'd taken the time to come up with one. 

The only other movie in the last 10 years that would fit into the horror genre, that I have really, really liked was The Mothman Prophecies.  And that fits loosely into the genre at best.  I'm sure it had something to do with the lack of understanding of the mothmen creatures that again added to their creepiness if you will.  And by far my favorite line from that movie was in response to Richard Gere asking "If they are so advanced why don't they just explain themselves to us." And the line was this "You're more advanced than a cockroach.  Ever try explaining yourself to one."  The movie carried on and they never fully explained anything about the entities but left the characters trying to guess.  It's like the Polanski take on Rosemary's Baby.  By not showing you the child's eyes it's far worse in the individuals imagination than it could ever be on film. 

I guess I just prefer to be left to my own conclusions and not just about the meanings of things, but the motivations as well.  It's a much better experience than going from A to B to C and here is why X did Y to Z. 



Oh , and that being said I would like every shot of every David Lynch picture explained to me in great detail because he makes my head hurt sometimes.  LOL