Pan's Labrynth

[Andrew1911]

I absolutely loved this movie.  Between this and Children of Men, I think I could make a very strong case for why only Mexicans should be allowed to direct films from here on out.  The acting was great all around, and the captain was terrifying.  Del Toro managed to stage a simple scene of him shaving in a mirror as a completely tense, horrific event. 

It's also a very sad movie.  Sad, yet hopeful, kind of like Children of Men.  And there are explosions!  Always a plus.   

2006 was the year of the Mexican.

[MrTorso]

I just got back from a showing of it. I liked it a lot. I have liked del Toro since I saw Cronos in '93. Good stuff.

[Dr.Impossible]

I generally enjoyed this movie as a sensory experience, but I do somewhat agree with the complaints about the ending.

My only complaint about the ending is that it does sort of kill the parallels that the faun's character had with the captain. In my opinion it seems as though the faun should have turned out evil, they seemed to be building up to that the whole movie only to crap out at the end. But it wasn't enough to ruin the movie for me.

However, I don't believe the ending is necessarily inconsistent with the notion that one shouldn't obey simply for the sake of obedience. One could say Ofelia learned that lesson right at the end when she decided to defy the faun, and was rewarded for it.

[Variety of Cells]

To respond to your spoiler, I agree, it's not inconsistent.  It had to happen that way, or else it would be been inconsistent.  Which is why I thought the ending was predictable. 

[Dr.Impossible]

To respond to your spoiler, I agree, it's not inconsistent.  It had to happen that way, or else it would be been inconsistent.  Which is why I thought the ending was predictable. 

Consistency > unpredictability, in my opinion. I think a lot of people place too much emphasis on unpredictability, as odd as that may sound.

[Variety of Cells]

You have to be unpredictable in films.  A movie is no fun if you can see where its going.  You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter, and then you start questioning the screenwriter.  Though it does have to stay within a certain realm of possibility.  If you thrown in a surprise ending that is surprising just because it doesn't make any sense, then the audience will hate you.  Unless you're David Lynch.  Then you can do whatever the hell you want and people will love you for it.

[Dr.Impossible]

You have to be unpredictable in films.  A movie is no fun if you can see where its going.  You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter, and then you start questioning the screenwriter.  Though it does have to stay within a certain realm of possibility.  If you thrown in a surprise ending that is surprising just because it doesn't make any sense, then the audience will hate you.  Unless you're David Lynch.  Then you can do whatever the hell you want and people will love you for it.

Yeah, David Lynch gets a pass. M Night Shyamalan, on the other hand....

[PsypherPunk]

You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter...

Why does "smart as a screenwriter" sound like a euphemism for 'dumb as a plank'? 

[Dr.Impossible]

You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter...

Why does "smart as a screenwriter" sound like a euphemism for 'dumb as a plank'? 

Depends on the screenwriter, I guess.

[dignan]

You have to be unpredictable in films.  A movie is no fun if you can see where its going.  You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter, and then you start questioning the screenwriter.  Though it does have to stay within a certain realm of possibility.  If you thrown in a surprise ending that is surprising just because it doesn't make any sense, then the audience will hate you.  Unless you're David Lynch.  Then you can do whatever the hell you want and people will love you for it.

I don't agree with that.  I highly enjoyed the movie Beerfest, even though I knew where it was going the whole time.  Any sports movie, essentially, is basically the same thing, over and over, but I always find them fun.   

[Variety of Cells]

You have to be unpredictable in films.  A movie is no fun if you can see where its going.  You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter, and then you start questioning the screenwriter.  Though it does have to stay within a certain realm of possibility.  If you thrown in a surprise ending that is surprising just because it doesn't make any sense, then the audience will hate you.  Unless you're David Lynch.  Then you can do whatever the hell you want and people will love you for it.

I don't agree with that.  I highly enjoyed the movie Beerfest, even though I knew where it was going the whole time.  Any sports movie, essentially, is basically the same thing, over and over, but I always find them fun.   

Consider yourself the exception that proves the rule.

But had to be a little surprised.  If you were able to predict each joke then they wouldn't have been funny.  Humor comes from the unexpected.  Maybe you were able to predict the general plot of beer fest, but not every joke. 

[dignan]

You have to be unpredictable in films.  A movie is no fun if you can see where its going.  You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter, and then you start questioning the screenwriter.  Though it does have to stay within a certain realm of possibility.  If you thrown in a surprise ending that is surprising just because it doesn't make any sense, then the audience will hate you.  Unless you're David Lynch.  Then you can do whatever the hell you want and people will love you for it.

I don't agree with that.  I highly enjoyed the movie Beerfest, even though I knew where it was going the whole time.  Any sports movie, essentially, is basically the same thing, over and over, but I always find them fun.   

Consider yourself the exception that proves the rule.

But had to be a little surprised.  If you were able to predict each joke then they wouldn't have been funny.  Humor comes from the unexpected.  Maybe you were able to predict the general plot of beer fest, but not every joke. 

Well no, certainly not.  But I also didn't predict the dialogue that was going to be said at the end of Pan's Labyrinth, either.  If the circumstances at the end of the film seemed predictable, it might have something to do with the first shot of the movie clearly foreshadowing the end.  That's intentional, and that doesn't automatically lower its quality.  Is Sunset Boulevard any less entertaining because you know William Holden is going to be dead by the end?  It's still a great movie for me.  Same holds for Pan's Labyrinth.         

[Variety of Cells]

You have to be unpredictable in films.  A movie is no fun if you can see where its going.  You start to feel as smart as the screenwriter, and then you start questioning the screenwriter.  Though it does have to stay within a certain realm of possibility.  If you thrown in a surprise ending that is surprising just because it doesn't make any sense, then the audience will hate you.  Unless you're David Lynch.  Then you can do whatever the hell you want and people will love you for it.

I don't agree with that.  I highly enjoyed the movie Beerfest, even though I knew where it was going the whole time.  Any sports movie, essentially, is basically the same thing, over and over, but I always find them fun.   

Consider yourself the exception that proves the rule.

But had to be a little surprised.  If you were able to predict each joke then they wouldn't have been funny.  Humor comes from the unexpected.  Maybe you were able to predict the general plot of beer fest, but not every joke. 

Well no, certainly not.  But I also didn't predict the dialogue that was going to be said at the end of Pan's Labyrinth, either.  If the circumstances at the end of the film seemed predictable, it might have something to do with the first shot of the movie clearly foreshadowing the end.  That's intentional, and that doesn't automatically lower its quality.  Is Sunset Boulevard any less entertaining because you know William Holden is going to be dead by the end?  It's still a great movie for me.  Same holds for Pan's Labyrinth.         

You don't necessarily know that it's Holden who's in the pool.  American Beauty would be a better example.  But in both of those examples, the ending was still a surprise to me.  I'm not arguing that everything in a movie should be a surprise, but there has to be some unpredictability.  And I never said Pan's Labyrinth was a horrible film.  I just said the ending was a little predictable for me.  For the most part, it wasn't predictable. 

[Dr.Impossible]

I think the whole "this movie is too predictable" complaint generally comes from nerds who try to outwit the movie instead of sitting back and enjoying it. Ditto "this movie isn't scary!" from people who think being creeped out by a horror movie means they lost to it. I know this because I used to be one. Then I learned how to truly enjoy movies instead of watching them compulsively.

A lot of movies actually give away the ending at the beginning, and it doesn't ruin the movie.

Of course, if a script is just SO cookie cutter you see everything coming a mile away, and especially if it's a thriller or something that relies on shocks, yeah that sucks. Like this movie "Identity..." anyone see that? It's one of those big shock-turn mindfuck movies where

it turns out all the characters are facets of a man's multiple personality disorder

but you totally know the big twist before it ever happens. When the big payoff is what you see coming, yeah that does suck.

Ok, have I rambled incoherently long enough?

[Variety of Cells]

Nerd yourself dude.  The reason I was disappointed with the ending is because I wasn't trying to figure it out, I just knew it had to happen.  I'm not saying that it's so incredibly predictable.  Most people probably won't see it.  I'm just saying I did, and my expereince was not as pleasant as a result.