Any movies we ALL like?

[Petey Wheatstraw]

All right, let's steer back to the topic, now. :^)

Yeah, that's probably a good idea.

Okay...how about The Flying Deuces?

[daltysmilth]

Has anyone said they dislike MST3K:TM yet? 

[Pak-Man]

Almost too easy. :^)

[Dr.Impossible]

Has anyone said they dislike MST3K:TM yet? 

Really. A good question even outside of the forum. Has anyone ever known someone to NOT like it?

[6079SmithW]

Has anyone said they dislike MST3K:TM yet? 

Really. A good question even outside of the forum. Has anyone ever known someone to NOT like it?

A friend of mine didn't like it because she only liked Joel. This wasn't a veteran of the fanboard wars or anything, she just kind of disliked Mike. It wasn't really a fair comparison, though, because the only episodes she'd seen (as far as I know) were Pod People and I Accuse My Parents, and almost anything else would be a let down at that point.

[Petey Wheatstraw]

Has anyone said they dislike MST3K:TM yet?

Really. A good question even outside of the forum. Has anyone ever known someone to NOT like it?

http://www.moria.co.nz/sf/mst3k.htm

This person clearly has no sense of humor, although I do agree with some of his other reviews.

[Sharktopus]

Speaking of which, does anyone not like Song of the South? Now that's a great movie.

Yeah, I can't think of anything funnier than dated ethnic sterotypes.

You've never seen the movie before in your life. It's a wonderful film with a good message.

That's true, I haven't seen it. But that's only because Disney's made it damn near impossible to find. I figured there's probably a reason they're ashamed of it. (Although they don't seem to be ashamed of crap like Kronk's New Groove...)

[Pak-Man]

Actually they're trying to hide it because they're afraid everyone would see an ethnic stereotype. There was really nothing bad about how other races were portrayed. Dumbo came under some fire too for the same reason. :^)

[Tyrant]

  To borrow Carlos Mencia's philosophy regarding racist stereotyping, the best way to respect other people is to make fun of them (and yourself as well). 


   I won't go into modern Disney (which I hate more than I've ever hated anything ever before, and I hate ALOT of stuff), but classic Disney rocked, and Dumbo was one of my favorites. I don't see how anyone could not love that movie. It actually had a pretty good message too, in my opinion.

[Pak-Man]

Yeah, but those crows were awful black! Seriously, it's not like they were portrayed as bad people. It's no worse than all the Irish cops you see in old cartoons.

[Steve-O]

   I won't go into modern Disney (which I hate more than I've ever hated anything ever before, and I hate ALOT of stuff), but classic Disney rocked, and Dumbo was one of my favorites. I don't see how anyone could not love that movie. It actually had a pretty good message too, in my opinion.

Dumbo got grief because the crows were considered by some to be offensive.  I mean, they're crows, y'know.  Which are black.  And they're voiced by.. *gasp*... black men!  And then they launch into an ensemble jazz number!  My god, it's worse than cross burning.

The fact that the crows are among the most sympathetic characters in the film -- in fact, are the only sympathetic characters beyond Dumbo, Mrs. Jumbo, and Timothy Mouse -- apparently slid right by the political correctness brigade.

Oh, and people were also pissed that the roustabouts were black.  I personally never worked with a traveling circus in the early 1940's, but I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that the manual labor force was not a model of progressive ethnic diversity.

[6079SmithW]

   I won't go into modern Disney (which I hate more than I've ever hated anything ever before, and I hate ALOT of stuff), but classic Disney rocked, and Dumbo was one of my favorites. I don't see how anyone could not love that movie. It actually had a pretty good message too, in my opinion.

Dumbo got grief because the crows were considered by some to be offensive.  I mean, they're crows, y'know.  Which are black.  And they're voiced by.. *gasp*... black men!  And then they launch into an ensemble jazz number!  My god, it's worse than cross burning.

The fact that the crows are among the most sympathetic characters in the film -- in fact, are the only sympathetic characters beyond Dumbo, Mrs. Jumbo, and Timothy Mouse -- apparently slid right by the political correctness brigade.

Oh, and people were also pissed that the roustabouts were black.  I personally never worked with a traveling circus in the early 1940's, but I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that the manual labor force was not a model of progressive ethnic diversity.

Well, Uncle Tom is a pretty sympathetic character too- broad stereotypes and embarrassing portrayals are bad for being dehumanizing, not for making characters unlikable (although I don't want to think through the idea of dehumanizing anthropomorphic crows.) People shouldn't dismiss great art because it has queasy elements, though; even Birth of a Nation, which rivals Triumph of the Will for horrible politics, is worth watching for what makes it good, regardless of all the stuff in it that's bad.

And old school Disney animation is lovely. Fantasia, for instance- I don't actually care for the conceit in a lot of parts, since I find it annoying not to be able to think of a classical piece without dancing hippos getting involved, but it's visually amazing. And the part with the demon king of night is among the best things I've ever seen.

[Pak-Man]

Hey. Now we're getting somewhere! OK. Anyone have a problem with Disney's Alice in Wonderland?

[Sharktopus]

Hey. Now we're getting somewhere! OK. Anyone have a problem with Disney's Alice in Wonderland?

Only that it's bears only a passing resemblance to the books. The movie's okay on its own - but it could be much better.

[Steve-O]

Well, Uncle Tom is a pretty sympathetic character too- broad stereotypes and embarrassing portrayals are bad for being dehumanizing, not for making characters unlikable (although I don't want to think through the idea of dehumanizing anthropomorphic crows.)

True enough.  My point is that, for allegedly being blatantly racist, the crows come off as more intelligent, creative, and decent, than any other supporting character in the film.  Yeah, there are some elements of the characterizations that border on cheap stereotypes, but I think you'd be hard-pressed to find many films made before World War II that don't dip into that well.  In Dumbo's case, I see no malice in it.

People shouldn't dismiss great art because it has queasy elements, though; even Birth of a Nation, which rivals Triumph of the Will for horrible politics, is worth watching for what makes it good, regardless of all the stuff in it that's bad.

I couldn't agree more.

I also think it's important that the sketchy elements remain in place for their historical value.  If the zeitgeist of the early 20th century was that a little casual racism was perfectly acceptable, it's important that people be able to witness that through the arts.  If it inspires the audience to regret or outrage, all the better.  Whitewashing over the ugly truth doesn't do anybody any good. 

You have to know which direction you came from if you don't want to accidentally end up back there.