Mike Nelson on Riffing Good Movies

[Hugo]

From a recent Mike Nelson interview at http://www.teevee.org/archive/weblog/2006/10/12/150746.html:

TeeVee: Do you, then, find it a little more or less unbearable sitting through the new horrible movies than you did the old horrible movies?

MJN: It?s pretty much the same. It?s really?

TeeVee: Horrible is horrible.

MJN: Yeah, and it?s really? In order to make it all, to make it fun when you?re actually doing it requires a lot of work. And, yeah, it?s painful. I mean, I think even if you? If I had to write a RiffTrax to ?Casablanca?? which I would, obviously, never do, but let?s just say I did. I think by the end of it I would hate ?Casablanca? even though it?s my favorite movie. It?s just the intimacy with which you have to go over it. But with most movies there?s some element where they bungled it and they fumbled the ball and they made a fundamental error.

And looking at it so closely, you get so angry about it, like, ?Why didn?t somebody fix that?!? And that happened so much in the writing room, where suddenly a writer would snap and go running up to the TV and put his middle finger up to the screen and just hold it there and start cursing out the TV. And you?d have to talk him down, like, ?It?s okay. It was just a little error, you know, it?s a bad acting job, it?s nothing to get upset about.?

TeeVee: All right. So there are some movies, then, that you would consider ?untouchables.?

MJN: Yeah, I mean, I think there?s movies that there?s no reason to do it unless you were being provocative. I don?t think I would do ?Casablanca?, I wouldn?t do ?It?s a Wonderful Life? unless there was some vastly different way to do it, or I thought I could improve upon it or? And I think there?s also, comedies don?t really work, even lame comedies, because what do you say? If their comedy failed, you just say? you just keep pointing out that their comedy failed. It?s not funny. So you have to kind of make your own thing, and? A certain earnestness to the film helps and? So yeah that?s kind of? You know, I just do it by instinct, and I?m probably not going to do ?Casablanca? or something like that.

It seems fairly clear in this interview that MN considers RiffTrax to be about riffing on "horrible" movies. He, at least, seems to agree with the interviewer's choice of words and characterization of what he is doing. Also, MN says that he sees no reason to riff some movies like "Casablanca" or "It's a Wonderful Life," presumably because he likes them and doesn't see how he could "improve upon" them.

It's also interesting to note that he thinks that if he did do "Casablanca," he would end up hating the movie because of the process of writing a RiffTrax for it.

So, this leaves me doubting the position of those who think that RiffTrax is not about riffing bad movies, and that there should be no problem in watching a RiffTrax of one of your favorite movies. Is there any hard evidence that MN would agree with your position? He is, after all, the inventor of RiffTrax and should have a reliable view on the purpose and impact of his product. And it seems to me that he considers RiffTrax to be about taking on bad movies and leaving good ones alone. He does say that he "goes by instinct," but it seems that his "instinct" is selecting movies he doesn't like.

[Hank]

MJN: Yeah, I mean, I think there?s movies that there?s no reason to do it unless you were being provocative. I don?t think I would do ?Casablanca?, I wouldn?t do ?It?s a Wonderful Life? unless there was some vastly different way to do it, or I thought I could improve upon it or?

Yet, he has a poll right on the front page which lists ?It?s a Wonderful Life? as a choice for riffing.

I think that he is a little contradictory in that interview, not to mention sounding quite a bit pompous.

You could also interpret that interview to mean that there is a grey area between "great" and "horrible" that may be acceptable to riff. It seems that he won't do the (in his opinion) "great" movies, but some of the "good" ones are fair game.

Honestly, I think that he was simply playing to the interview(er). I've known people who have taped interviews (myself included) wo have said, "I can't believe I said that!"

[mrbakasan]

As far as its a Wonderful Life in the polls, it could be that it is just there for filler or that one of the other Rifftrax emplyees made it, just for the sake of making a poll about X-Mas movies.  I don't think he was being contradictory.

[Pak-Man]

The polls continue to bamboozle me. It's been said in interviews that they'd never go as far as Showgirls, but Showgirls was on the very first poll. I can only guess we're being felt out based on our replies, but it's just free feedback in the end. :^)

[Tarantulas]

The polls are merely there for mod enjoyment 

[MontyServo]

The polls are merely there for mod enjoyment 

I had to pull this long ago quote out here.  I used the search feature!  Woo Hoo!

Hello all.

The poll page is mostly a suggestion page, though we absolutely DO consider the polls when deciding new movies.

And I think at the end of the day, regardless of the polls, it is Mike's decision.  There goes all hope for me seeing It's A Wonderful Life.  But he also said he didn't want to do comedies, even lame ones, so maybe we won't get Jingle All the Way either??  I bet the Xmas movie ends up being The Polar Express.

[ScottotD]

I hope not, the kids in that movie look scary as hell.

[Hank]

And I think at the end of the day, regardless of the polls, it is Mike's decision.  There goes all hope for me seeing It's A Wonderful Life.  But he also said he didn't want to do comedies, even lame ones, so maybe we won't get Jingle All the Way either??  I bet the Xmas movie ends up being The Polar Express.

There's also
The Grinch - comedy
The Santa Clause - comedy
Nightmare Before Christmas -1/2 comedy (dramedy?)
The Polar Express - comedy/adventure (w/ Eddie deezens, how could it not be?)
Bad Santa - black comedy

The thing that I don't get is that he says (about comedies) "If their comedy failed, you just say? you just keep pointing out that their comedy failed. It?s not funny", but most riffs are on the failure of some element or another, so why should comedy be any different? When they do monster movies, all the riffs aren't "That's not scary. That looks fake!" I'd like to give Mike a little more credit than he gives himself and believe that he could treat a comedy like any other..
Maybe a pure comedy wouldn't work, but something like "Catalina Caper" would (very much did) work, where you have an (attempted) serious side. And who could forget "Santa Claus Conquers the Martians" or even "Santa Claus"? Both are some of the best MST3K had to offer.

[Bob M.]

I'm a firm believer that there are no sacred cows, except the ones that Mike decides are sacred. Why? Because he's the guy putting in all the work, and until such time as he hires me as his editorial lackey (have your people call my people, Mike), I'm not the one saddled with 12 viewings of the same movie (except once it's riffed, in which case we're talking 20 or more viewings, of course).

Personally, I've got no qualms about seeing my favorite movies skewered. Because quality is largely subjective, what's great or not great is pretty gray; just because 100 movie critics say something's a classic doesn't mean it's a classic to me. I'd love to see my favorites all done up right proper Rifftrax style; however, since Mike's the guy glued to the couch, pen in hand, toiling over the funny, I'll leave the choices in his capable hands. I'll be happy with whichever films he chooses and continue to be a joyful Rifftrax consumer

Oh, and when are we getting t-shirts to buy, eh? Eh? eH? That's what I thought. Seriously, though, were are the t-shirts, guys?

[LadyKenobi]

MJN: Yeah, I mean, I think there?s movies that there?s no reason to do it unless you were being provocative. I don?t think I would do ?Casablanca?, I wouldn?t do ?It?s a Wonderful Life? unless there was some vastly different way to do it, or I thought I could improve upon it or?

Yet, he has a poll right on the front page which lists ?It?s a Wonderful Life? as a choice for riffing.

I think that he is a little contradictory in that interview, not to mention sounding quite a bit pompous.

Mr. Nelson may be many things--  musically highbrow, yes; curiously fixated on Patrick Swayze, certainly; slightly puffy, maybe--but "pompus" is absolutely one word I would never use.  I think what he's saying here that he wouldn't do those movies because he knows he couldn't improve upon them.  He knows there's no point to it.  I think that Rifftrax are about "fighting back," or, to look at it as an idealist would, the commentaries are an attempt to suck enjoyment out of a horrible movie-- to salvage it, so to speak. And there's no need to fight back against or salvage an already-good movie.

[Joe Don Faker]

I think that he is a little contradictory in that interview, not to mention sounding quite a bit pompous.

Mr. Nelson may be many things -- musically highbrow, yes; curiously fixated on Patrick Swayze, certainly; puffy, maybe -- but "pompus" is absolutely one word I would never use.

How about



"Pusillanimous pipsqueak!"

[Pak-Man]

Just to stir the pot a bit, Mike HAS indicated (in his grain of salt way) in his writings that he enjoys LOTR...

[MontyServo]

And I think at the end of the day, regardless of the polls, it is Mike's decision.  There goes all hope for me seeing It's A Wonderful Life.  But he also said he didn't want to do comedies, even lame ones, so maybe we won't get Jingle All the Way either??  I bet the Xmas movie ends up being The Polar Express.

There's also
The Grinch - comedy
The Santa Clause - comedy
Nightmare Before Christmas -1/2 comedy (dramedy?)
The Polar Express - comedy/adventure (w/ Eddie deezens, how could it not be?)
Bad Santa - black comedy

The thing that I don't get is that he says (about comedies) "If their comedy failed, you just say? you just keep pointing out that their comedy failed. It?s not funny", but most riffs are on the failure of some element or another, so why should comedy be any different? When they do monster movies, all the riffs aren't "That's not scary. That looks fake!" I'd like to give Mike a little more credit than he gives himself and believe that he could treat a comedy like any other..
Maybe a pure comedy wouldn't work, but something like "Catalina Caper" would (very much did) work, where you have an (attempted) serious side. And who could forget "Santa Claus Conquers the Martians" or even "Santa Claus"? Both are some of the best MST3K had to offer.

You're right, the entire poll is a sham, and he will be doing the 1994 remake of Miracle on 34th Street.  I guess we will find out eventually.  Personally, I would have no problem with any of the films listed being riffed (although my preference is It's A Wonderful Life).

[Joe Don Faker]

Naw, he'd definitely pick the 1973 version of Miracle with David Hartman in it.  Now with 100% more Roddy McDowall! 

[MontyServo]

Naw, he'd definitely pick the 1973 version of Miracle with David Hartman in it.  Now with 100% more Roddy McDowall! 

"That nose wheel feels mushy"