LoC #129 - Film Noir - rules and regulations

[Cyrusso]

I don't want to spoil my number one pick... but it is definitely a movie... that was made by some people... at some point in human history prior to this year... or it might have been released in 2021, I have no way of being absolutely certain.

[George-2.0]

I received a list via email and one from Cole, so I'm up to 6 lists (with mine), and I have Charles's to look forward to - so we're off to a good start. with some good lists.

Started work on a few write-ups too, I have about 16 that I believe have enough points to make the 50.

[George-2.0]

Update time as we're a week away from the deadline.

Show of hands - any other folk working on lists?

I wrote a couple of lapsed forum members who were film fans, Jesse412 and Fred Garvin -not heard back from either. The last time Jesse was here was April of 2020, but he's still active at Letterboxd. And the last time I talked Fred into doing a list was for Westerns in late 2018. I don't know if they'll respond, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

[Cyrusso]

Update time as we're a week away from the deadline.

Show of hands - any other folk working on lists?

I wrote a couple of lapsed forum members who were film fans, Jesse412 and Fred Garvin -not heard back from either. The last time Jesse was here was April of 2020, but he's still active at Letterboxd. And the last time I talked Fred into doing a list was for Westerns in late 2018. I don't know if they'll respond, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

I'm still hoping MikuFan will come back someday too and participate in the LoC's, but he hasn't been around in like five years. Same for SideSwipe. Yeah, I know why a lot of people on the forum has issues with him, but he's a fellow Transformer fan, so I do miss him on some level, even if I don't miss some of the things he said and some of his behaviors.

[George-2.0]

Update time as we're a week away from the deadline.

Show of hands - any other folk working on lists?

I wrote a couple of lapsed forum members who were film fans, Jesse412 and Fred Garvin -not heard back from either. The last time Jesse was here was April of 2020, but he's still active at Letterboxd. And the last time I talked Fred into doing a list was for Westerns in late 2018. I don't know if they'll respond, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

I'm still hoping MikuFan will come back someday too and participate in the LoC's, but he hasn't been around in like five years. Same for SideSwipe. Yeah, I know why a lot of people on the forum has issues with him, but he's a fellow Transformer fan, so I do miss him on some level, even if I don't miss some of the things he said and some of his behaviors.

It's interesting to look back at the early LoCs, when they were getting twice as many participants, and see all the names that are no longer around, like mrbasehart, Tripe, or SmilinJackRoss... time passes, things change, but you wish some of them were still here.

And wouldn't it be great if GregMcduck sent in a list for old times sake, that would be cool and nostalgic.

[Edward J Grug III]

Free online mini noir festival - https://arts.columbia.edu/noir

Anthony Mann's Border Incident (1949), John Farrow's Where Danger Lives (1950), and Orson Welles' Touch of Evil (1958)

Touch of Evil is the only one I can vouch for, and it's great - especially the famous opening long shot.

[George-2.0]

Border Incidents good, and you have John Alton doing the camera-work, so that's a plus. Never saw the Farrow film, but my Letterboxd people weren't impressed.

[Edward J Grug III]

Border Incidents good, and you have John Alton doing the camera-work, so that's a plus. Never saw the Farrow film, but my Letterboxd people weren't impressed.

Still, I'm happy to check out a Robert Mitchum noir for free

[George-2.0]

Border Incidents good, and you have John Alton doing the camera-work, so that's a plus. Never saw the Farrow film, but my Letterboxd people weren't impressed.

Still, I'm happy to check out a Robert Mitchum noir for free

Oh, absolutely. I'll be watching.

[Charles Castle]

I've given this a lot of thought, and while I don't want to discourage lists, I do want to take a moment to address this, seriously.

First... there are subjects where we have covered all the angles. Star Wars, for one, we've done the movies, music, characters, weapons, and vehicles. We've also explored superheroes and comedy and animation and games to exhaustive levels. But how often has a western film shown up on an LoC, how many martial arts or noir films have in the past or will in the future, had the spotlight, other than the spotlight they received as the subject of an LoC?

When we did Martial Arts, I had enough knowledge to make a solid list of 25, I knew Bruce and Jackie and Crouching Tiger and Hero and had just finished with Zatoichi... but as I was doing research I kept seeing this name pop up, Chang Cheh. "Who the hell was Chang Cheh", I thought, I've never heard of him, never seen one of his movies? But he's this big deal in martial arts, one of the directorial foundations of the genre. So I set out to watch some of his flicks and wound up watching a lot and had a blast doing so. But why did I do that, because I wanted to respect the subject - How could I do a list on martial arts if I hadn't even seen a single film from one of its giants?

That's all I ask here, that we respect the subject.

That doesn't mean that I expect you to binge-watch a bunch of classic noir, and I can't make you put Double Indemnity or Murder, My Sweet on your lists if you haven't seen them.... but, and it's early, I haven't received every list, but right now, there's a chance neither of those will make it. And if I get to the voting deadline and Batman and Sin City are at the top of the list and a Double Indemnity or Murder, My Sweet didn't even make the grade, then I have to ask... what was the point? All I've got is another comic book -or whatever- thread. Even though some Batmans and Sin City have noir elements and are acceptable - if we minimize noir in its pure, peak form, that's going to make me one sad host.

Now, I don't think it will go that far off the beam, I think we'll have a nice, balanced LoC to enjoy.

But I did want to call attention to this, especially with Muppett movies being brought up, and 'noir adjacent' being spoken of. Respect the subject, just as we've respected lists for animation, comics, games, etc... let a noir LoC be a noir LoC. Let it have this moment, as this is all the LoC love it's likely to receive.



Because if you don't, femme fatale Gene Tierney will get in her rowboat and hunt you down... 

Noir is my favorite genre by a long shot. If I had to sit and make a list of every movie I have ever seen that fits the definition, there is no doubt that the average noir is much higher in quality than the average (insert genre here) film. It's a pretty select genre, though, and the definition came post mortem, even if the influences were mostly common. I feel weird including any film in color, but since we are including post/neo/whatever there are a few I am considering.

This is my pointless preamble to expressing that one color film I will not be considering is Dark City. No comment on it's quality, or even the numerous aspects that meet the definition. You can't have that ending in noir. Just, no.

That seemed really important to me until I typed it. Now, do i still press 'post' or delete it or what?

Oh yeah. Since you gave a little space for procrastination with the deadline I decided to watch some new things and rewatch others. Nothing quite good enough to crack the list in the new pile, but totally enjoyed The Breaking Point and The Sound of Fury for the first time. Two totally excellent movies, neither of which would likely even crack my top 50. Crazy strong genre.

I'll polish off my list tonight, maybe tomorrow morning. Thanks so much for hosting. Film Noir lists are like my World Cup.

[George-2.0]

Perfectly valid opinion, no need to delete it. Though at first, I was like, Dark City was in color? And then remembered, oh he's talking about 90s Dark City not 50s Dark City...

I just brought that up as a friendly reminder to post dates if there are remakes or the same names.

Both of those titles you mentioned I like (I believe I even own one of them, under the title "Come and Get Me"), but did I 'top 25' like them?

I tried not to be too draconian, but I think I might have come off that way as some neo-noir heavy lists came with explanations... it's okay, I don't hate modern noir, I just wanted to make sure that's wasn't the only thing I was getting. I was hoping for predominately classic noir, with a dash of neo, not the other way around... and it's shaping up that way (the former, not the latter).

Looking forward to your list. And at least one old-timer I wrote, replied enthusiastically and is promising one as well.

Just a few more days to the deadline.

[goflyblind]

my list is just that dixon hill episode of tng twenty four times and the tiny toons istanbul (not constantinople) segment.

[Cyrusso]

my list is just that dixon hill episode of tng twenty four times and the tiny toons istanbul (not constantinople) segment.

Now are you 100% SURE it's Istanbul and NOT Constantinople? I mean... even Old New York was once New Amsterdam.

[stansimpson]

my list is just that dixon hill episode of tng twenty four times and the tiny toons istanbul (not constantinople) segment.

Now are you 100% SURE it's Istanbul and NOT Constantinople? I mean... even Old New York was once New Amsterdam.

Why'd they change it?

[Pak-Man]

my list is just that dixon hill episode of tng twenty four times and the tiny toons istanbul (not constantinople) segment.

Now are you 100% SURE it's Istanbul and NOT Constantinople? I mean... even Old New York was once New Amsterdam.

Why'd they change it?

I can't say.