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Author Topic: star trek phase2 reception  (Read 27160 times)

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Online Pak-Man

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #75 on: May 13, 2008, 11:33:11 PM »
I'm not sure if it was a matter of backing down at all. If I'm interpreting events right, Rifftrax thought they could without incident, they were told they couldn't, they stopped. I kind of doubt Rifftrax ever gave the middle finger to them and said, "We'll do what we want!" until some threat was made that made them stop.

Question, though: Now that Rifftrax doesn't provide the video, can you talk about Rifftrax at their forum?


Offline Edward J Grug III

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #76 on: May 13, 2008, 11:33:53 PM »
As much as I'm irritated right now that Rifftrax backed down on this issue...

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Offline ShadowDog

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #77 on: May 14, 2008, 12:24:36 AM »
This can't be a fantasy world, there's not enough PIE!
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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #78 on: May 14, 2008, 12:37:23 AM »
Or cake.  The cake was a lie.

But Rifftrax did the right thing.  Respectable, in the face of so much nerdy assault.


Offline ShadowDog

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #79 on: May 14, 2008, 12:46:05 AM »
Much as I hate to admit being wrong, (and I do hate it, believe me) having read most recent torgosPizza's reply in the other thread (which I only read after the comment I made above) I think they did the right thing.  I was just pissed off that the next video wasn't going to be synced up and I went too far venting my frustration.  I'm still not buying the next Phase 2 video, but that's no reason to question Rifftrax's manhood.
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Offline bettertomorrowamy

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #80 on: May 14, 2008, 05:01:41 AM »
Now you're a wuss.  Learn how to reauthor so we don't have to listen to you bitch and moan.
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Offline Flopsy T. Hamster

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #81 on: May 14, 2008, 05:45:03 AM »
Actually, I think the whole reason the Phase II guys asked Rifftrax not to distribute the file has less to do with protecting their episodes than it has to with providing accurate numbers to Paramount about how many copies are being downloaded. At one time, they didn't really care if episodes were posted to torrent sites. But just before "World Enough And Time" was released, Paramount asked Cawley to meet with them, and to set up a screening of the episode for them. The New Voyages producers were worried that maybe it was time for the sword to drop, and they were gonna be asked to stop. Fortunately, Paramount allowed them to continue, but asked them to supply details on how often the show was being viewed. You know those suits... they just LOVE ratings.

For the first few months, the only way to watch the episode was through streaming. Unfortunately, there were so many viewers, they killed the server a couple of time, and they had to withdraw it completely for a few weeks. I think it wound up being counter-productive for tracking purposes, as during that time, the only way to see it was to download a stream-capture from a torrent site.

Even though they'll never be able to supply accurate numbers, I guess they have to try as hard as they can to be as accurate as they can, and ask that only the official mirror distribute the files... even if it's for free.


Offline mrbasehart

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #82 on: May 14, 2008, 05:49:12 AM »
Yes, I know I can look this up, but how many episodes of New Voyages are there?


Offline RoninFox

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #83 on: May 14, 2008, 06:06:32 AM »
Actually, I think the whole reason the Phase II guys asked Rifftrax not to distribute the file has less to do with protecting their episodes than it has to with providing accurate numbers to Paramount about how many copies are being downloaded. At one time, they didn't really care if episodes were posted to torrent sites. But just before "World Enough And Time" was released, Paramount asked Cawley to meet with them, and to set up a screening of the episode for them. The New Voyages producers were worried that maybe it was time for the sword to drop, and they were gonna be asked to stop. Fortunately, Paramount allowed them to continue, but asked them to supply details on how often the show was being viewed. You know those suits... they just LOVE ratings.

For the first few months, the only way to watch the episode was through streaming. Unfortunately, there were so many viewers, they killed the server a couple of time, and they had to withdraw it completely for a few weeks. I think it wound up being counter-productive for tracking purposes, as during that time, the only way to see it was to download a stream-capture from a torrent site.

Even though they'll never be able to supply accurate numbers, I guess they have to try as hard as they can to be as accurate as they can, and ask that only the official mirror distribute the files... even if it's for free.

Thanks for that info, if this is the reason Rifftrax was asked to make the change its the first one that's really made sense to me.
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Offline Flopsy T. Hamster

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #84 on: May 14, 2008, 06:24:10 AM »
There have been four episodes released so far. "Come What May", "In Harm's Way", "To Serve All My Days", and "World Enough And Time". The first episode has been reclassified as a "pilot episode", and is not part of the official series. There was a HUGE jump in quality between the CWM and IHW, so I can kinda understand them wanting to make it a separate entity.

Ironically, CWM got the best treatment as far as a video release. There was an official special edition DVD pressed, and given to people who donated money to the production. The DVD is also available for download on a few of the mirrors. It has a commentary track, deleted scenes, bloopers, and easter eggs, if I remember correctly.

IHM also got an official DVD version available for download. It's barebones, but great quality, so it's the best way to watch the episode. There was a revised "directors cut" released of this episode, too, but only in WMV format. The unofficial DVD version of the director's cut was made from these files, so download the original version if you want the best quality. The director's cut only adds back in a few lines here and there. Nothing that you'll miss.

TSAMD has a couple releases. For mastering a DVD, I used the QuickTIme version, and got very good results. The video is in anamorphic widescreen, so you'll need to compensate for that.



Offline Nunyerbiz

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #85 on: May 14, 2008, 07:19:47 AM »
it's hard to argue with the power of torrent to get the word out...

Actually it's really easy - it's basically the opposite. I can see instances of bulletin boards that people have downloaded our tracks from, and it numbers in the thousands (of grabs). The people who are going there aren't having some epiphany of our existence (although in rare instances, this is the case) - it's more along the lines of  "Thank you! Please release [RiffTrax title] next!" and "Do more!"

Well, thanks for confirming the existance of pirates.

Do you really think you are helping the Phase2 guys in their efforts? Or is it more along the lines of "Thank You! Please riff [phase2 title] next!" and "do more!"

You want to complain about losing money when the Phase2 guys were never concerned about money in the first place. Do you fail to see my point?

Wait... Your original post specifically said:

""Oh... but I am helping Rifftrax by seeding this torrent of [insert product name here]".

Sure, they are probably right... despite the powers that be insistance otherwise, it's hard to argue with the power of torrent to get the word out... "

And Torgos defended that point.

Then you start talking to him like he's a retard?

WTF man?

Well, just to put this thing to bed... It was never my intention to talk to anybody like "a retard". So I will apologize if I came across that way.

The general point that I was going for was that you can't complain about unauthorized third party distribution of your work (ie. torrent), when you are doing the exact same thing to the phase2 guys.... acting as an unauthorized distributor.  pot kettle black basically.


Offline Conor

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #86 on: May 14, 2008, 08:52:45 AM »
The reason there is a difference is because when Phase II talked to us and explained where they were coming from, we respected their thoughts on the matter.  If we had done the same thing to The Pirate Bay they would have posted our letter and made fun of us.


Offline Flopsy T. Hamster

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #87 on: May 14, 2008, 09:19:22 AM »
The reason there is a difference is because when Phase II talked to us and explained where they were coming from, we respected their thoughts on the matter.  If we had done the same thing to The Pirate Bay they would have posted our letter and made fun of us.

Yeah, there's little point in contacting most torrent sites. Most of them, especially Pirate Bay, actually enjoy refusing to take torrents down.

I think the big distinction is that Rifftrax are a commercial product, and are being sold. New Voyages/Phase II is a fan produced project given away for free on the internet. It's easy to assume that something being given away for free is similar to "public domain" without realizing that the authors may want to keep control over the distribution of the files.

To be honest, though, the only way I would have ever known about Rifftrax is from a download at a torrent site. When I downloaded it, though, I had no idea what it was, and as soon as I realized that it was Mike and the boys, I visited the site, bought a few Rifftrax, and made good with a donation. So, some good did come of it. Not that it justifies it in any way. But I do wish that Phase II had an easy way to donate to their production. The only form of donation they can accept is a non-monetary donations, such as mailing them gift cards to places they can buy supplies from. If they had a PayPal system set up, I'd gladly match the $3 I paid Rifftrax (or more). Being in Canada, I can't really do that.


Offline Nunyerbiz

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #88 on: May 14, 2008, 09:29:28 AM »
The reason there is a difference is because when Phase II talked to us and explained where they were coming from, we respected their thoughts on the matter.  If we had done the same thing to The Pirate Bay they would have posted our letter and made fun of us.

I understand that and I wasn't trying to imply that anybody on the rifftrax side was being unscrupulous. In no way am I trying to defend piracy... but I don't think because you changed your approach after the fact does anything to invalidate my point. Sharing / redistributing / giving away / stealing  "for profit" work is wrong... but it's a different stroke from the same brush if you are redistributing volunteer work for a profit. While maybe the letter of the law is on your side... It's akin to spraying Glade in the bathroom... the shit still stinks... but just smells a bit more flowery. The fact that you respected the wishes of the originators of the work really doesn't sway my opinion that the whole thing was in poor taste to begin with.


Offline bettertomorrowamy

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Re: star trek phase2 reception
« Reply #89 on: May 14, 2008, 10:16:03 AM »
Can't we just get beyond Thunderdome?
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