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Author Topic: I just bought The Death of Superman...  (Read 5221 times)

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Offline gbeenie

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Re: I just bought The Death of Superman...
« Reply #30 on: March 29, 2008, 03:22:39 PM »
zoom, are you saying you don't like All-Star Batman and Robin, The Boy Wonder?
"All I ask of you is one thing: please don't be cynical. I hate cynicism -- it's my least favorite quality and it doesn't lead anywhere.
Nobody in life gets exactly what they thought they were going to get. But if you work really hard and you're kind, amazing things will happen."

- Conan O'Brien


Offline zoom

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Re: I just bought The Death of Superman...
« Reply #31 on: April 07, 2008, 06:39:24 AM »
zoom, are you saying you don't like All-Star Batman and Robin, The Boy Wonder?

I know it's blasphemy to dislike any Batman related Frank Miller stuff, but I have to be honest, I'm not diggin' All Star Bats.  I LOVE every single bit of Miller Bat lore from Dark Knight to Year One, but All Star just seems like a parody of them.  It's like Miller's trying to out gritty/noir himself.  The "I'm the Goddamned Batman" line was what did it for me.  Combined with the 'let's put Robin in a cave full of rats the first night after his parents death' just makes me think Miller is joking or something.  I did have a slight fondness of his Joker issue, but a lot of the issues are more miss than hit.  I kinda liked the Hal Jordan issue as I found it funny but somewhat disrespectful to Hal at the same time.  Miller tends to treat him more like an idiot than a hotheaded test pilot, but it is Miller's universe so he can do as he pleases to a certain extent.  So overall I've liked some of All Star Bats, but there's more to dislike for me.  I actually like Miller's takes on the other heroes surrounding Batman more than his take on Batman.  Him completely disrespecting Grayson and Alfred just doesn't feel like Bruce Wayne to me and puts me a little off.

It's all just my opinion, it's just that I was SO excited for this All Star line up I had a huge let down with All Star Batman.  I was looking much more forward for Miller's Batman than Morrison's Superman and I ended up falling in love with Morrison's more.


Offline gbeenie

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Re: I just bought The Death of Superman...
« Reply #32 on: April 08, 2008, 12:43:39 PM »
Have you read issue #9? I was kind of wondering where the book was going, myself, until I read that issue. Now I understand just what Miller was going for; he may have played his hand slowly, but seeing his cards now makes the book more than worthwhile for me.

Here's a hint: having Robin around changes Batman.


p.s. None of this is to diminish All Star Superman, which IS pretty incredibly brilliant.
"All I ask of you is one thing: please don't be cynical. I hate cynicism -- it's my least favorite quality and it doesn't lead anywhere.
Nobody in life gets exactly what they thought they were going to get. But if you work really hard and you're kind, amazing things will happen."

- Conan O'Brien


Offline zoom

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Re: I just bought The Death of Superman...
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2008, 06:14:24 AM »
Have you read issue #9? I was kind of wondering where the book was going, myself, until I read that issue. Now I understand just what Miller was going for; he may have played his hand slowly, but seeing his cards now makes the book more than worthwhile for me.

Here's a hint: having Robin around changes Batman.


p.s. None of this is to diminish All Star Superman, which IS pretty incredibly brilliant.

I have to admit, I've read it and can't remember it in it's entirety but I do recall it being one of my favorites other than the Joker issue of the series.  I remember Batman and Robin going to the graveyard and did get the sense that Batman is taking on Robin to try to bring himself back to reality or at least get some sort of emotional feeling back.  I've got to hand it to Frank Miller, he does have a love and knowledge of comics obviously.  Upon taking on Robin in the 1940's, the Batman titles did take on a lighter tone, which is what I think Miller is alluding to subtly .  I think that's where my problem with All Star Batman is (I'm not trying to bash it, just state my opinion), Frank Miller seems to be doing more of a commentary on the heroes; rather than writing with or for the heroes, he seems to be writing on the heroes and their history.  I think that's why I kind of have a love hate with the issue, it feels part history lesson of comics, part parody.  I love the all American hero version of Supes, as that's what Superman was during WWII, a big Nazi fighting American bong selling hero.  I love the jokes about Hal making stupid constructs with is ring like hotdogs and giant boxing gloves, why the hell would a hotshot test pilot make those?  I love Wonder Woman's attitude towards Batman.  It just feels like Miller is looking at this title from the outside rather than placing himself in it.  With that said, I'm going to pick up the issues again and re-read them as I'll take any excuse to read any comic lol.

Not trying to bash the All Star Batman, it's just I expected a bit more I guess.  I do like certain things about it, like how it's following Dick Grayson (which is surprisingly original come to think of it), the commentaries and certain moments, it's just that those moments don't outshine the bad for me.

Morrison somehow managed to bring back the goofy sci-fi of the silver age.  Superman's not Bryne-depowered, he's not having to deal with his classic rogues on a near constant basis, and the story takes place well towards the end of Superman's career.  I love Geoff Johns, but even his current Superman arc pales in comparison to Morrison's, and I'm not even a huge fan of Morrison.  I was just so surprised and taken back by it.


Offline mlcorcoran

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Re: I just bought The Death of Superman...
« Reply #34 on: April 14, 2008, 11:42:06 AM »
All-Star sucks. In the 3 years since it debuted they've managed to publish 10 issues of crap.

Frank Miller should never be allowed to write a Batman story ever again. DKR and Year One are classics, but 20 years later he writes DKR2 and butchers it.

The DC and Marvel stories Frank wrote in the 80s were all amazing. Batman, Daredevil, you name it.

His original material is awesome too. Sin City, Ronin, 300, all awesome.

But when he came back to Batman in the 2000s, he apparently still had Sin City on the brain, because his interpretation of Batman is just Marv in a Batman costume, which is to say it's not truly Batman at all.