Penn and Teller: BS!

[pyro]

When God sent the Ten Commandments to Moses on Mount Sanai, He was giving firm commandments to His people on how they /should/ live. But the people didn't always do that, and third parties didn't always respect it. Thusly, civil wars that erupted throughout the Kingdoms of Israel resulted from disobedience, and wars were fought with other countries to stop attempts of foreign invasion. Also something to consider is what society was like back in that time, in that culture. We look upon some of the images in the Old Testament with modern, western eyes, and turn away in disgust. Yet a movie like "The Last Samurai" comes out and no criticism is given toward the way the Japanese kill themselves and slice off their heads because of shameful defeat in battle.

Great post though I don't entirely agree with all of it.... My only real problem with it though is the comparison of The Last Samurai and the bible above...  That's a pretty odd comparison seeing as the disgust of the culture the Old Testament has to do with mostly with the idea that it's there alongside other passages being used against gays and etc.

[Pak-Man]

I just want to say that I'm sorry on behalf of any Christian who claims to be preaching the word when really they are just painting a negative stereotype for the rest of us...

That's the sad irony of it all. Its the ones who proclaim to be super-devout that make us Christians look like a bunch of babbling psychos. I really can't blame a lot of the people who don't take it seriously when the ones that preach loudest are also preaching the most garbage. Christianity gets a bad stigma from people who think they're doing God's work, and proclaim to be doing God's work, but actually end up ignoring God all together to serve their own ends. I don't think God looks as kindly on those people as those people would like to think.

[J-Proof]

Ah -- I see.

I was trying to explain in so few words that there were social conventions at the time that have since changed for westerners. Things that we find unreasonable now, were not always unreasonable to those people. The principle of what is good and bad has not changed, the practices around that idea have evolved.

God also wasn't narrow-sighted when it came to gay people versus straight people. King David was a womanizer and murderer (his son Solomon was a /wise/ murderer). But what made the difference wasn't that one cardinal sin was worse than the other. God didn't say, "Well, homosexuality is most evil of the evils, so there's no hope for those guys." He said, "Anyone that repents can come back to me whenever they want." Which is what David and Solomon, and a score of other patriarchs did.

As for whether or not something actually /is/ "sinful" or "wrong" that discussion is entirely different, and is subjective in debate where relativism goes against universality. A fun discussion, nonetheless!

In the end, my only plea is for people to be open not just to their own beliefs but to everyone's beliefs. I am a Christian, and wish not to be judged by the way any other Christian may or may not live their lives, but based solely and completely on how /I/ live /my/ life. We must remember that all people are flawed in many ways, and that we cannot accurately depict the greatness of this God we worship all the time -- so throw us a bone, man!

And again, I'm sorry if someone in your past threw a bible at your face and spat on you, cuz the only spitting Jeuss ever did was to cure someone's blindness -- never to scorn.

[J-Proof]

I just want to say that I'm sorry on behalf of any Christian who claims to be preaching the word when really they are just painting a negative stereotype for the rest of us...

That's the sad irony of it all. Its the ones who proclaim to be super-devout that make us Christians look like a bunch of babbling psychos. I really can't blame a lot of the people who don't take it seriously when the ones that preach loudest are also preaching the most garbage. Christianity gets a bad stigma from people who think they're doing God's work, and proclaim to be doing God's work, but actually end up ignoring God all together to serve their own ends. I don't think God looks as kindly on those people as those people would like to think.

Amen. And also a disclaimer: We are NOT pointign fingers at anyone on this board. I think this board is full of incredibly intelligent folk, willing to discuss rationally.

[Rude]

...

Um, so... yeah. Penn & Teller are pretty cool, huh?

-Rude

[J-Proof]

I rmemeber this one trick where they made a woman's nipple disappear and reappear..... that was bizarre.....

[ScottotD]

You saying youve NEVER done something that you didnt already want to do?  Sometimes your wants are overruled by other things. 

yes but that's usually due to a law or something, not a hypothetical rulebook.

[J-Proof]

yes but that's usually due to a law or something, not a hypothetical rulebook.

I guess you could say that laws are all parts of hypothetical rulebooks... I mean, who's to say a law is just or unjust if it is simply selected by the masses in regards to their own relative points of view?

AAAAAAAAH

[RandyMistie]

Reality is what you can get away with...

Dudes, I was just outside collecting my recyclables and just enjoying a brisk spring evening and I looked up and saw a bright Half Moon, (Mezzaluna, an excellent italian vodka, btw!), and a few stars were hanging from a glowing, indigo sky and the breeze was sweet and the trees were sighing... I just said, "Thank you!".  That's all the religion you should ever need.

Peace.

[pyro]

you can always just worship the sun.... or monsters

[RandyMistie]

you can always just worship the sun.... or monsters

In fact, I DO worship the Sun, AND monsters!  Way to be insightfully ironic!  LOL!

[Reductio_ad_absurdum]

Thank you J-proof and Sarcasm, you two were able to say what I thought but was unable to say.  I have much to learn in apologetics, and I hope any of you will rebuke me if I say something you feel is not Biblical.  I can only grow if I am corrected.

My wish is to use my potential to the fullest God wishes for me, and I am scared of becoming an inadvertant false prophet.

[pyro]

you can always just worship the sun.... or monsters

In fact, I DO worship the Sun, AND monsters!  Way to be insightfully ironic!  LOL!

You sound like a perfect candidate for Carlinism or Monsterology.... or whatever the Carlin one my friend made up is.... and I'm starting to think I promote Monsterology more than the Rev himself

[Reductio_ad_absurdum]

you can always just worship the sun.... or monsters

In fact, I DO worship the Sun, AND monsters!  Way to be insightfully ironic!  LOL!

You sound like a perfect candidate for Carlinism or Monsterology.... or whatever the Carlin one my friend made up is.... and I'm starting to think I promote Monsterology more than the Rev himself

What extremes of monsters are we talking about here?  Classical ones like the werewolf, boogey man, or the ever popular Death?  Or are we talking about humans who went nutty, started killing people, and found immortality somehow like Jason, Freddy, and Chucky?

EDIT:  Ironically, I was afraid of Chucky as a kid until I actually watched it.

[pyro]

Werewolves and etc... He talks a lot in the pamphlettes about wolfman and dracula and etc....


I never was allowed to watch any of those as a kid...  But then again I wasn't even allowed to watch The Simpsons in 6th grade.... but then again I had been watching South Park since 3rd grade...