Star Trek 2009 sucks!

[mrbasehart]

This thread is basically everything that's wrong with the internet.

[RVR II]

Man! I hate I went to bed 6 pages back!
Yet another classic derail

[Thrifty]

[Doc Who]I knew it, obviously this forum is not for vanilla lovers. Anyone who likes vanilla should be taken out and shot.[/Doc Who]
thank you thank you, tip your waitress.....

I would like to know something, did anybody actually ever try to communicate with Doctor
Who in private to find out what his issues were? Or did everybody just keep picking on him
anyway without any attempt at understanding?

Via E-Mail or private message?  No.  But we have tried reasoning with the man.  I once very politely told him that his frequent outbursts seemed like someone who needed mental help, and provided links to several social services that could help him free of charge.  Several people on this forum have tried to be patient and extend olive branches of understanding multiple times, but nothing ever changes.  He continues to throw temper tantrums and histrionic meltdowns and derail civil conversations.  We have tried to be nice but he keeps spitting in our faces. 

Put up with it another 6 months and you'll see.

[Thrifty]

Well, we shouldn't ridicule him on the spot for being who he is or for things he seems to have little control over. When not in freak-out mode, Doc Who? has provided a good many engaging and interesting conversations here. He's a good person, he just seems to have trouble percieving the greys between black and white. He seems to take disagreement as a personal affront, and while that's not the right kind of attitude to have in a crowd of snarky naysayers like us, it should probably be met with more understanding than is shown at times. Take the time to explain that while you might not agree with his opinion, it doesn't mean you think less of him for having it, and he usually calms down.

Speaking personally, I think that if I could get even one month's respite from the endless tirades, I could regain some patience.

[Thrifty]

A few years back he pretty much admitted he had Asperger's.  Plus, after a few years patience and understanding, and an untold number of complete and utter freakouts, things give way to loathing.  Hence, ridicule.

I have a cousin who has Asperger's, yes, I am serious. It has been a struggle not to ridicule
her when she acts like a total jerk, but I don't do it. You know why? Not just because
she is family, but because when people have a disability they cannot help but be the way
they are! That does not entitle me or anybody else to ridicule them behind their backs because
we don't like the way they behave. There's nothing amusing about belittling somebody or acting
condescending when they may very well feel they are justified for feeling the way they do.

Cool.  I commend you on the high road.  However, this board used to be my regular site, even was my home page for years.  But people like the illustrious Doc tried my patience, derailing every thread to culminate in someone somewhere being taken out and shot, or claiming that everyone hates him.  While he might have a problem, he does nothing to change it, and since he still posts prodigiously, he will try the patience of some people here.

Plus,  I freely admit that I'm kinda of a bastard.  ( See what i did there....)

Thumbs up. 

I have issues too.  At times in the past on this forum and others, as well as in real life, I've allowed my ego and my anger to rage out of control, and I would say these unbelievably cruel things to people just to hurt them.  This wasn't one or two people, it was a lot of people.  And I still do occasionally lash out.  I was diagnosed with clinical depression 20 years ago, and have struggled with various medications and therapists since then.  However, I have always recognized that I was responsible for how my disorder affected my behavior and other people's perception of me.  Doc seems content to shrug and say "I have a disease" and use that to run uncontrolled.  Again, it's like a noisy child running free in a nice restaurant, and you just say "It's okay he's just a child".

[doggans]

Not to be all "on topic" and everything, but I do have a few things to say about the Kurtzman/Orci debate from last night.

I love the fact that people always claim that Star Trek is just like Transformers. I don't think anyone would be saying that if two of the writers hadn't worked on Transformers. Given their track records as writers and creators on Alias,Lost,and Fringe I am guessing they were doing Tranformers because they were hired to write it and Bay wanted the movie done one way so they gave him the script he wanted.  Most writers have to do whatever work comes their way and one of the things they have to do is give the director the script he wants,I don't see why Trasformers should be held against them for the rest of their lives. Outside of those three movies they have a pretty good track record.

That's completely moronic if they were that good they wouldn't lower their standards just to please the director.

You're making the HUGE assumption that what we see on the screen in the Transformers movies IN ANY WAY resembled what was on the page. Given the "bad improv" nature of all of the Witwicky scenes, I think the only actors who stuck to scripted lines were the ones who had to spout technobabble.

I can't find it right now, but I remember watching a round table discussion with the screenwriters of several blockbusters, including either Kurtzman or Orci, I forget which. While they couldn't say anything explicitly negative about the films, they certainly implied conditions that would make anybody turn in shoddy work. Scenes were made for the trailer before the first word of the script was written, and those scenes had to be worked in. The deadlines were VERY short, and the script constantly had to be rewritten--except it couldn't in the case of Transformers 2 because of the writers strike. And, of course, whether or not the script was even *followed* was completely at the whim of the director, when it wasn't at the whim of the studio.

A credited writer can rarely be blamed (well, at least not solely blamed) for the quality of a Hollywood film. And thank God, because I'd hate to dismiss Bill's work on RiffTrax just because "Meet Dave" sucked.

That said, for all I know Kurtzman and Orci COULD still be bad writers. I haven't seen much Fringe (despite several obsessed friends), so I can't say much about their work on it one way or another.

[anais.jude]

I want to bring back the Doc Who topic:

Gunflyer, I have been very patient and understanding. I wrote a rather nice post to both him and Imrahil explaining why I wanted them to stop bickering in my Star Trek thread (The one that started it all!)

My issue with Doctor Who is that he refuses to learn from his mistakes. When people have made a point to explain why his argument is strawmanning, why we are not ganging up on him, or that WE ARE NOT GOING TO KILL ANYONE THAT MISSPELLS A WORD, he comes back the next day like it never happened. I want nothing more for Doc to have a wonderful life (which is what I wish for everyone on this board except that one dude) but if you don't remember the past and learn from it, the present will not be any different.

[Thrifty]

Hate to do another "me too" post, but Anais sums it up rather nicely.

I can understand how our actions can seem cruel to an outsider who isn't familiar with the history of this board and its interactions with Doc.

[ScottotD]

I would like to know something, did anybody actually ever try to communicate with Doctor
Who in private to find out what his issues were? Or did everybody just keep picking on him
anyway without any attempt at understanding?

For about 4 years or so I attempted to converse and rationalise with him and... whoever that angry woman was that he'd often get caught in out-of-control arguements with but I gave up on both of them a year or so ago when it became clear rational thought wasn't something they were interested in.  Honestly I was stunned to learn Who wan't around 14 years old semi-recently, also, I AM REPORTING ALL OF YOU!  Expect some sort of pompous bollocks from Tripe by way of punishment.

[sarcasm_made_Easy]

pompous bollocks from Tripe

This sounds remarkably dirty.

[Bob]

Expect some sort of pompous bollocks from Tripe by way of punishment.

"Pompous Bollocks" is the name of my Clash cover band.

[Russell]

For about 4 years or so I attempted to converse and rationalise with him and... whoever that angry woman was that he'd often get caught in out-of-control arguments with but I gave up on both of them a year or so ago when it became clear rational thought wasn't something they were interested in.  Honestly I was stunned to learn Who wan't around 14 years old semi-recently

See the thing is the way everybody seems to talk while he's around doesn't seem so much designed to be reasonable
with him but to put him even further on the defensive. If he hasn't got a reason to be defensive then nobody is to blame,
not even him, it's the disorder he suffers from. If people talked about me the same way they talk about him on this forum
I might be paranoid and constantly argumentative as well.

Via E-Mail or private message?  No.  But we have tried reasoning with the man.  I once very politely told him that his frequent outbursts seemed like someone who needed mental help, and provided links to several social services that could help him free of charge. 

How would you feel Thrifty if somebody sent you links like that? It also strikes me that there's not really any
polite way of telling anybody they need mental help. I guess the best thing to say would be we're here for you,
I don't know, I'm not an expert and I admit I'm not privy to everything that went on before.

[sarcasm_made_Easy]

This thread is like a train wreck, specificaly it is like that train wreck in inception where the train just keeps on going. 

A train wreck that keeps on truckin'. 

[D.B. Barnes]

For about 4 years or so I attempted to converse and rationalise with him and... whoever that angry woman was that he'd often get caught in out-of-control arguments with but I gave up on both of them a year or so ago when it became clear rational thought wasn't something they were interested in.  Honestly I was stunned to learn Who wan't around 14 years old semi-recently

See the thing is the way everybody seems to talk while he's around doesn't seem so much designed to be reasonable
with him but to put him even further on the defensive. If he hasn't got a reason to be defensive then nobody is to blame,
not even him, it's the disorder he suffers from. If people talked about me the same way they talk about him on this forum
I might be paranoid and constantly argumentative as well.

Do you not understand what people are saying here? The sympathetic, reasonable, patience train left the station a long, long time ago.

[ScottotD]

For about 4 years or so I attempted to converse and rationalise with him and... whoever that angry woman was that he'd often get caught in out-of-control arguments with but I gave up on both of them a year or so ago when it became clear rational thought wasn't something they were interested in.  Honestly I was stunned to learn Who wan't around 14 years old semi-recently

See the thing is the way everybody seems to talk while he's around doesn't seem so much designed to be reasonable
with him but to put him even further on the defensive. If he hasn't got a reason to be defensive then nobody is to blame,
not even him, it's the disorder he suffers from. If people talked about me the same way they talk about him on this forum
I might be paranoid and constantly argumentative as well.
 

[/quote]

I don't want to be rude but I think there's only so long a group of... basically strangers can be expected to humor someone.  That's why I've chose to (largely) just ignore him and several other memebers who I felt it wasn't worth my time/frustration trying to figure out or talk to.